Winnipeg Free Press

Winnipeg Free Press (Newspaper) - January 3, 1903, Winnipeg, Manitoba Manitoba morning free press Winnipeg. Saturday. January a a. H. A. Again Call at league fleeting held in Montreal a Resolution was adopted that Lontreal be permitted to defend cup provided no game is the usual scale of prices prevail and that hereafter no games be played until end of league Delegate Delegate who was chief mover made Nasty aspersions against Victorias claiming they Are out for Money and not say they Are ready to go to Montreal pay All their own expenses and give their share of Gate receipts to the leave matter of one game in hands of trustees Montreal Jan. Canadian Amateur hockey league held a special meeting to night at the request the Montreal team to consider the Posi Tion of the Stanley cup matter. There Ivere present messes. Harry Trihey shamrocks f. A. My Kublic. Victorias j. I. Dixon Ottawa e. B. , Quebec and c. C. Chitty Montreal. The. Re was first a motion to recon Tuler the action of the general meet ing in refusing to allow the cup to he during the hockey sched ule trustee Ross writes. The n i by ions letter a Road from or. P. Hoss , pm i the trustees rehearsing All Tho Truxil in Ami insisting that the trustees nil not been arbitrary but on Tho contrary most desirous of reach air a to with the league. He Niibu o discourteous treat ment by league Anil a ii l that had written live limes since he did not even get a re ply. The trustees were tired of this neglect but nevertheless in their co sire to reach an understanding offered that the present Winnipeg Victoria Challenge were played Early no future Challenge a Ould be accepted before the end of the season. The trustees thought Montreal had adopted an honorable course in asking a special meeting of the league to obtain permission to play during the season and hoped that the club would be allowed to de fend the cup. Or. J. P. Dixon of took exception to or. Ross1 statements and said thai though he had attended every meeting of the league for years he never heard anything about such letters from the trustees. To show their Good Faith the league shortened their season by Over a week. Or. Chitty s views chitty in presenting the Case of the Montreal club said that the c. A. H. L. Was tiie oldest and strongest association and entitled to More consideration any other. The whole question was whether the autonomy of their league was not of More import Ance than playing Stanley cup matches. He added that the Montreal club was willing to give up some of its rights of the pressure brought to Bear by some of tiie older members and because of the abuse of Toronto and other Western papers. Though or. Ross had said the trustees wrote five times there was nothing on record to show it. He moved that the Mon Treal club be Given permission to de fend the cup before february 10 and this was seconded by or. A Croffie of the Victoria s. Dixon Springs amendment or. Dixon of Ottawa threw Many aspersions on the sportsmanlike Char Acter of Winnipeg and said they had never Given any valid reason for not playing in March although the Arena records showed that there was Al ways ice until after March 22. He urged that the association should not allow itself to be badgered or bulldozed by Western newspapers. He then sprang a Surprise by moving a Amend ment that Montreal be allowed to de fend the cup against Winnipeg Vic Tobias upon these conditions i 1. Should be one game in Stead of three. 2. That the Price of admission should or Money and the conditions would make the club show its hand. He frankly said that Winnipeg would probably not accept the conditions but had tried to put the league in a. Hole not exceed the regular prices of the c. A. H. L. 3. That the trustees give an Assur Ance that hereafter All such games should take place after the league sea son ends. He said that the real question was or. Army age Speaks. Whether Winnipeg was out for sport and this was the time for it. He had shown his proposition to or. Ross who said that the terms were hard and if the competitors could not agree the trustees would order two of three games or the most goals in two be unfair to Winnipeg but or. Dixon said that was the very Point the Ottawa club wanted to make. It was matches and that one match would now up to Winnipeg to say whether they were out for Money or sport. Or. Mcrobie of the Victorias approved of the Ottawa proposition be cause it would show if Winnipeg was in Earnest. Chitty Only True sport. This was All new to the Montreal club and its representative or. Chit to made an energetic protest against the conditions. They had found the Winnipeg Victorias Good sports and it was unfair to ask them to travel Miles or one match. He went on to Point out that the Montreal Arena and not the Montreal hockey club controlled the prices. In re ply to a question mr., Northey Secre tary of the Arena said that in one such first class match there might be or. Trihey supported the Ottawa amendment As a Compromise. If Winnipeg refused Why there was a Way out of the difficulty. When it came to a vote or. Chitty alone opposed the amendment of the Ottawa Delegate which was Carrie d by 3 to 1. Another proposition was then made that Montreal having asked for a special meeting should pay the expenses of the Quebec and Ottawa delegates but this was laughed out of court especially in View of the re sult of their request for permission to defend the cup. Or. Army age Speaks. Says Victorias will pay own expenses to Montreal and give share of receipts to the poor. President Waugh the Victorias could not be seen Hist night in re Gard to the proposition agreed to by the c. A. H. L. At their meeting in Montreal but or. J. C. G. Army age was shown the above report and he conversed freely Over the probable outcome. Or. Army age strongly resents the statement that the Victorias Are out for Money and not for sport and he authorized the free press to announce that he fell fully confident the Victorias would suggest that the entire Gate receipts at the Stanley cup games in Montreal be Given to some charitable institution. We he said pay All our own expenses to Montreal and if they think it is Money we Are after we will give up cur share of the receipts no matter what the Montreal club nor the Arena rink people i was net altogether said or. Arny Tage that they pro pose we should Only play one game. Of course we prefer having Best two out of three but we Are quite willing to leave that matter in the of the trustees and if they decide on one game Only then we will consent. We want to show those people we Are in the game purely for the sport of it and the statements that have been made late have been entirely in called trustees will decide. Or. P. D. Ross says a meeting will to called to consider new proposition. Ottawa Jan. P. D. Ross when asked what action the trustees would take now that the c. A. H. Had decided to permit Montreal to play but one game for the Stanley cup said the trustees will have to meet and consider the question and until that meeting takes place i do not care to give an opinion in the Ter. It is not a question for one trustee to business Favien of Winnipeg reject the proposition of Bethune roundly on government ownership of railways results in a rejection of a declaration of the theory. The adjourned meeting of the Board of Trade was held yesterday afternoon to discuss resolutions introduced two meetings previous re Garding railway bonuses. Or. Crowe the vice president was again in the chair. After the meeting was called to order or. Mccreary asked to speak on a matter of privilege. He wished to Challenge a statement made by or. Bethune that the passenger traffic on the inter colonial railway was Uil 1-u per cent dead head. This statement proved by or. Mccreary to be untrue and he read a message from the minister of rail ways to show that there were fewer passes granted on the i. C. R. Than on any other trunk line in Canada. Or. Bethune replied that he bad rot his information from a prominent rail Way Olli tial. But was not at Liberty to give his name. Or. Win. Georgeson then opened tiie Ilc Bate on the Resolution. He did nut he had to say As upholding altogether the policy of tin Canadian 1 Sci rec. He thought that tile practical management of the c. P. K. be in Winnipeg. Re Ferring to the part of the Resolution saying that the railway policy of the is vicious or. Georguson Spicl that while he had not been a snip utter of the government he did nut Uhink it was fair to treat the prime minister of the government with anything but respect. It is not said or. Georgeson. To take the position of affairs As they an to Day and say that the govern ment ten years ago. Made 3. Mistake in he arrangement then Mac. It would not be fair Twenty a Vii i from now when affairs Are in a More advanced state of Progress to say that things done to Day were wrong. If men s foresight was As Good As the we would All a Clever Fellows. If there is any viciousness. I think it is established by air. the real danger. The speaker then referred to the government ownership of rail ways mild he stated he would not like to think that in the present state of affairs there would be a transcontinental Road in the hands of any government. The Power in their hands with thousands of men employed would be too great for elections. The speaker did not think further that discussions of a political nature should be discussed by the Board of Trade. He could see the action of sir Wilfrid Laurier if he re us a message from the Board of Trade calling the policy his government vicious. He could imag Ine sir Wilfrid s indignation and would not condemn him for so feel ing there is no supporter in the House of commons for the ment ownership railways. Or. So Thune stored. He agreed with or. Bethune when that gentleman said that some of the Board were not members honestly. He believed or. Bethune was right and that or. Get line was not there Hon Estly. When the hand of politics was seen in any Resolution it should face quashed. The movers of such a Reso Lution do not want the upholding of a movement for commercial purposes but for purposes of politics and their piles cured in 3 to 6 nights. One application gives Relief. Or. Agnew s ointment is a Boon for itching piles or Blind bleeding piles. It relieves quickly and permanently. In ski eruptions it stands without a. Rival. Thousands of testimonials if you want evidence. 35 motives the speaker called vicious and i said or. Floor Gesund concluding that Reso Lution introduced for the Benefit of a parly should be quashed no matter what the personal opinion of the members the Resolution in ques Tion is such a How do you asked or. Bethune. That a what i said or. concluded his speech with the Hope that the members would vote Down the Resolution. Or. Gilroy. Or. Thos. Gilroy opposed the Prin Ciple of government ownership of rail ways he held that railways should be left to private Enterprise should he left to tiie people themselves under proper his and restrictions. The Best examples for us were Tho Mother country and the to United states. In which railway had reached their highest development. If the system of government ownership had been desirable it would have been Vio Ted icing ago. 1c not desirable for them it would not be for us. He could not speak personally of govern ment railroads in Germany and aus we. Georgeson one of the speakers at yesterday s Board of Trade meeting. Thalia but from information he had received it had not been an entire Success. A gentleman of High stand ing in business circles in Australia had stated that there were great objections to it one being that Public corporations including the govern ment had become great interest paying machines. A gentleman of the utmost respectability and intelligence now Here who had lived in new Zea land had left that country because of Public ownership everything which was crushing out individualism. Hut if the system were desirable there it would not follow that it would be desirable Here. A thought such enormous far reaching Power should not be Given to the governments of Canada. Government ownership in the Case the inter colonial railway had never succeeded. It had been stated that one third of the travel on that Road was not paid for. To adopt such a system would be madness of the Many for the Benefit of the the rest of the people to carry them for nothing. Where was Competition to come from if not from numbers of roads Competition is the life of Trade we must look to it for secur Ity greater facilities and better ser vice to the Public. A professor of Harvard University had shown that in 27 years 1s35 to 1ss2, in new York the charge per mile had fallen from to s7 cents one Quarter of what it was before. The saving effected to the people of the United states on fare not by legislation but by Nat ural causes brought about by com petition was to we want and we cannot get it except by this natural if Thod. We will be glad to see the grand trunk come in on reasonable terms. If it had acquired interests in this country it would have been a great Factor for development. The Resolution was essentially for govern ment ownership if the Board passed it they would be saying to the g. T. Ti., Don t ome you Are not wanted Here we want the government to build a the company had not yet a Skol for Aid but there would be ample time to consider the matter. He believed the principle had been carried to excess but what we would not do might have been Wisdom at an earlier period. Many things done for the opening up of the country were wisely clone they were the acts of statesmen but now the conditions had changed. The coming of the grand trunk would be a Good business pro position. It is a splendid thing in the Eastern provinces but we cannot pronounce on the terms now. 1c we give valuable franchises the interests of the people should be protected and they should receive Kampta equivalent for advantages Given. Or e. D. Martin. Or. E. D. Martin speaking next wished to reply to some remarks by or. Belcher. In reference to or. Georgeson s remarks concerning sir Wilfrid Laurier s attitude if the Board sent Down a Resolution such As suggested or. Martin said that in the Campaign literature of sir Wil Frid of 180ij the words speculation robbery and were used in connection with the giving of sub you have no right to say said or. Mccreary. I can produce the said or. Richardson. He is not authorized by sir said or. Mccreary. Or. Martin dropped the Point and went on to speak of Competition on railways and pointed out that owing to traffic arrangements among roads there was no Competition. He cited cases of the a p. R. And great Northern showing that the1 latter Road could not carry freight into Manitoba owing to the action of the c. P. R. As or. Belcher s state ment that the grand trunk would be kept out of the country he denied it. There was nothing in the Resolution to that effect. What was wanted was to have the grand trunk come in with As Little Cost As possible. If or. Belcher s intention was that the subsidies should be on the same basis As were Given in the past he would not like to see the government receive the authority to give any sub Sidy. Railways in the United states Cost the Public nothing and carried freight for less Money than in the Dominion. He had not heard these statements refuted. He reiterated statements along this line made by or. Brock and or. Bethune. As to or. Belcher s remark that even with a saving of to the government Canada would not want German railways or. Martin said he had it from a Well known citizen that the second class car of a Ger Man Roach was As Good As a Compart ment car Between Chicago and St. Paul. In Switzerland the speaker said the system is a remarkable one and spoke of other places where government roads were very Success Ful and Drew conclusions to show that because certain systems which were in Force in old countries were not a Good that they would be necessarily adopted Here if the government oper ated railways. Another aspect of the questions under discussion the speaker pointed out was the pos sible Sale of one railway to the other and the Only Way to prevent this would be to own the Road from Ocean to Ocean. Or. John love. Or. John love took up the question of Public ownership of railways in other countries and gave figures of in Terest in regard to them. In new South Wales the Gross earnings were 3% per cent Over the expenses. In Vic Toria none of the railways paid expenses. In Germany and Russia the roads were military roads in the first place and Only secondary for Trade purposes. Germany pays 5.94 per cent on its railways but he had no information As to what rates were charged for passengers. In Italy the roads had been transferred to private Enterprise. Switzerland had been held up As one of the most successful countries in Public ownership of railways but the fact was they were still private enterprises and will not be taken Over by the state until May 1903. Or. Love held that it would be Gross insanity for tiie Board of Trade to pass a Resolution like the one proposed. In their own affairs the members would never dream of coming to such a decision. Nobody was More opposed than he to Bounsing asap plied to commercial enterprises. To using a railway in a new country might be a business proposition under certain circumstances. In an old coun try it would be an Absurdity but he could conceive of its being a duty of other settlers better situated to put their hands in their pockets and pay for the accommodation of others. But the Bonus should in any Case be made As Small As possible. Or. Belchor. Or. H. M. Belcher said the Board should look at the matter in a prac tical business Light. The grand trunk was a thoroughly efficient railway and to say that it not compete with lines up Here was absurd. The first Effort of railways would be to show that they could handle the traffic bet Ter than others. This was a kind Competition we want now. Conces Sions would be made to get business. It was one of the first principles of business that Competition does com Pete though it May not bring Clown prices immediately. It was Idle say that the Resolution does not say any thing against the grand trunk it follows that if we want a government Road we do not want the other. Asle Gards subsidy the Board need not say anything about it unless it was Neces sary. They might express their pleas ure at the Advent of the grand , Ana the opinion that an Independent through line in urgently needed by this Western country and the whole do minion. This was a business proposition in a Concrete form the other matter would naturally drop it seemed to be a shadowy thing in the future. He suggested that the govern ment be urged if Aid were granted to see that the fullest guarantees were required to ensure efficient service at the lowest practical rates. Or. Buchanan. Or. D. W. Buchanan suggested that it would simplify matters to Divide up the Resolution As it contained practically three distinct propositions first in regard to Bounsing it declares against the principle secondly it advises the government not to Grant bonuses except in certain cases thirdly there is the subject of state rail ways which could be debated for Days without coming to any decision. He did not see much difference Between subsidizing railways and Bounsing local industries. In the latter Case we were pretty sure the Money would be spent for the purpose but when rail ways were bonuses the Money had often gone into the pockets of the promoters. The Resolution did not say that no assistance should be Given the grand trunk. There were other ways of assisting besides Bounsing namely by loaning or by purchasing the Bonds which he thought would be better. He would be very glad to see the grand trunk come in. He thought it might be Wise to drop the third clause. Or. Evans. Or. Sanford Evans spoke of the Resolution having been already published in Toronto As the opinion of the Winnipeg Board of Trade. The Board should in View of this consider the effect of now expressing As suggested pleasure that the grand trunk 1 was comln2. Tha Resolution was one which the Board would have no Justi location in passing. The Board did not know the several things affirmed that had been Given by can Ada to Aid railways that no evidence has been adduced to Etc. Whereas it can be Etc. Whereas the Only real solution of our transportation Etc. The Resolution in that form was a Busi Ness like the Board should appoint a committee to investigate thoroughly before making such declarations. The Board did not yet know enough about what the grand trunk intended to do. He thought if the Road were built from Gravenhurst or North Bay right through North of Lake Winnipeg with branches to Winnipeg Regina and Calgary it would require government assistance. It could not afford to put Winnipeg on a Branch line. The Board did not know enough about to Jedi whole proposition to endorse it or to condemn it. The Board had already recommended an alternative scheme by which the intercom onial might become an effective fac Tor by being extended to georgian Bay or across the continent and had asked that an expert should a appointed to work out the problem in differ ent ways. The Board being on re Cord As having taken this stand should not pass this Resolution. An amendment. Or. A. Strang moved in Amend ment to the motion seconded by or. H. M. Belcher that Titis Board welcomes with pleasure the Prospect of the grand trunk Pacific railway building to this country but not being aware of the kind of Aid asked for by that com Pany if any or any knowledge of the part of the country to be opened up by it is not now in a position to express an opinion As to the advisability or otherwise of granting Aid to the projected line or lines. Or. Bethune proposed with the e. D. Martin one of the speakers at yesterday s Board of Trade meeting. Consent of his Seconder to Divide the Resolution into two the one dealing with the xxi estion of Aid to railway corporations and to e other with government ownership. Amendment to a question Havir to the position the take it having Bee Ference to the v amendment to the moved by or r. D ended by or. H. Amendment g been raised As amendment would n moved with re Hole motion an amendment was Richardson Sec 3. Grotty As Fol lows whereas it is the declared intention of the promoters of the grand trunk Pacific railway Enterprise to ask parliament for a valuable rail Way franchise and to further de Mand from parliament Large sums of Public Money in the shape of donations or guarantees and whereas it is announced that the Canadian Northern railway com Pany is also seeking further Large of Public Money therefore be it resolved that in the opinion of this Board the policy of donating Public moneys or extend ing Public credit to railway corporations has been demonstrated to be unsound and vicious that this Board respectfully urges upon the Dominion government and parliament that no Money donation or Bond guarantee be granted to the grand trunk Pacific railway or the Canadian Northern or. Bethune in closing the debate said that not oni argument had been advanced in support of the subsidy principle. He held that it must be assumed the desire of the people of countess Castillano born Anna Gould is coming to America with her two sons Boni and and will spend the greater part of the Winter with her family. This will be her first visit since her marriage. Manitoba was that there should be government ownership of railways seeing that at the last provincial elec Tion they sustained the party that had this Plank in its platform. As the railways had paid it was impossible to comprehend Why they should be subsidized. Experience had not shown that with More railways we get reduction of traffic rates. If the c. P. R. Had control of All the roads it could give better rates As the duplicating of expenses would be done away with. Amendment carried. Or. R. D. Richardson s amendment was lost by a vote of 24 against to 0 in favor and or. Strang Amend ment was carried 25 voting in favor and 7 against. The members present at the meet ing were g. R. Crowe in the chair a. B. Bethune. A. Strang r. J. Campbell w. Whyte w. Georgeson t. Gilroy w. S. Evans d. E. Sprague a. M. Belcher d. A. Clarke j. Love h. S. Crotty e. D. Martin r. L. Richardson w. F. Mccreary g. A. Mitchell. R. T. Rutherford j. W Dafoe w. R. Allan John Aird g. W. Erb d. W. Buchanan r. To. Richard son r. Barclay n. , g. V. Hastings t. M. Ross. W. J. Christie e. L. Lightcap e. H. Macklin j. C. Crome t. D. Robin con Jos. Huxley 1. E. Fairchild h. S. Rolston. F. Phil Lipps f. W. Drewry a. Wickson c. H. Cordingly John Gibb c. N. Bell Secretary. Carnduff. Carnduff dec. Festive sea Eon at Carnduff was marked by the performance of a cantata entitled. Santa Glaus the Hall was crowded and card Tufts musical reputation took a dig jump. Miss Francis Hepburn of Elmore. Wae United to or. We. Braden. Of Winsboro the nuptial knot being tied by the Rev. H. J. Galley of Cari Evale. Hitherto the three agricultural societies in Southern Assiniboia have held fall fairs till this summer when Gainsboro inaugurated a summer fair. Carnduff and Alameda have decided to follow suit so that 1803 will see the summer fair in the ascendant. The mock parliament had an inter Esting meeting on tuesday night when a Battle Royal waged Between Premier Taylor and or. Connell m. L. A. There is a great exodus of visitors to the East this Winter. Among them is w. C. Coade j.p., who goes to Mitchell ont., and who has not been East of Brandon for eighteen years. The Beaubier s Christmas. It. L. Hills co. Proprietors of the Beaubier Myrte th.first Christ Mas in the hotel a record breaker. Elaborate preparations had been made to serve the Largo number of guests who their Christmas a Tinner at this pop ular hotel. The dining room was most decorated with evors Reens Flowers Etc. The Bill of fare was As follows raw oysters. Oyster a la Creme. Chicken consomme. Fish. Salmon Steak. d hotel. Fresh cod. Cream sauce. Fresh lettuce olives Whitt onions. Gherkins. Mayonnaise of lobster. Chicken salad. Entrees. Domestic Duck Aux Petit pois. Small tenderloins with mushrooms. fruit. Pine apples an Glase rum. Boiled. Boiled Turkey. Oyster dressing. Sugar cured Ham Champagne sauces. Steamed Young Chicken red currant Jelly. Roasts. Sirloin of beef Yorkshire pudding. Leg of Lamb. Sauce Munthe. Manitoba Goose Apple sauce. Young Turkey. Cranberry sauce. Young suckling pig with dressing. Venison a jus. Vegetables. Boiled and mashed potatoes. Sweet Corn. Stewed tomatoes. Green peas. Pastry. English Plum pudding Brandy Saucci hot mince pie. Green Apple pie. Lemon pie. California Pear tart. Honey tartlets. Dessert. Charlotte russe. Port Sherry and Orange jellies. Jelly in Orange cases. Vanilla ice Cream. Christmas cake Swiss Jelly Roll. Lady fingers. Kisses Coconut macaroons. Candles. Almonds. Filberts. Layer raisins. Oranges. Bananas. Snow apples. California grapes. Mclaren s cheese. Stilton cheese. Black Tea. English breakfast Bacon. Coffee. Green Tea ;